coolant level rises when cap removed

Started Yesterday at 07:43 AM, By It works exactly the same way as your hot water tank or central heating radiatorsat home. Thanks, the thing is that it wont go down now, its all the time at the same level. I have on my Multivan wierd problem maybe someone from you could help me. With the radiator cap removed, install the block tester per manufacturers specifications. Nope, when the engine is cold, the coolant level is on the cold mark right now, so it isnt over filled, So Im guessing I shouldnt be checking for bubbles? At this point I believe it refills the volume one to one; at the end of it all you should have a refilled coolant system with no air. In fact a lot of radiators now dont even have a cap anymore. With pressure applied to the system, inspect all of the components in the cooling system for leakage. er dontpannic I spent weeks diagnosing this until I came to the conclusion it was the headgasket. Repairs covered by 12-month/12,000-mile warranty. I dont think this is something to be concerned about. Step 1: Let the engine cool. Thus, the float rises and falls with the level of coolant in the expansion tank. Its getting too hot in here, so put more coolant in. If you have overfilled it the tank cap will contract allowing bypass to drain valve and dump excess coolant. Using the cooling system pressure tester, test the cap and see if it will hold the pressure noted on the cap. Can you borrow a known good coolant reservoir cap? Your previous content has been restored. But then even a short section of heater hose that is above the level of the cap will drain down and out. I take it none of you are plumbers or heating engineers? I look forward to having Mike Folsom as my go-to mechanic. Started Sunday at 05:08 PM, By Park your vehicle and apply the parking brake. Step 5: Add coolant dye to the system. Using the manufacturer-recommended coolant and coolant ratio, grab a funnel and fill the reservoir until the level reaches "Full." Replace the cap, wipe up any spillage, and close the hood. Replace the cap, wipe up any drips, and close the hood. Using a 50/50 mixture of GM Dex-cool antifreeze and water, slowly fill the pressurized side (3) of the surge tank until the system is full of coolant. Park your car, allow the engine to cool and open the hood. Youll also need a flat workspace, such as a garage floor, driveway, or street parking thats also well-ventilated. Started Thursday at 07:32 PM, By This can be an electric fan or a mechanical fan driven by the engine. The most popular service booked by readers of this article is Car is overheating Inspection. Did an awesome job getting me back on the road in the same night! If not, and you want it done, ask your mechanic to do it. You will notice all of the rubber hoses also go from hard to soft as ou release the pressure of the system. When it cools, a vacuum is formed that allows atmospheric pressure to push the fluid back into the system. Concentrate, however, might save you a bit of money, like buying Gatorade powder instead of the bottled drink. Also no visible coolant leak (need to check this more). How to check if an SSM2220 IC is authentic and not fake? I would 100% recommend him. A failing thermostat is the most common cause of overheating. This is easily solved,take your radiator cap off as your car is running in a properly working coolant system that is bled the coolant will just flow by not come out, bubble out.Pressure regulated by the cap dosen't build until the engine reach temp from the expansion of fluid/vapor and even then at operating temp you should be able to vent the pressure remove the cap and coolant not bubble out.If your vehicle does something different from this you have a problem.The only reason I didn't say the car above has a thermostat problem is because at lower temp the bypass would keep the system from building that much pressure.Theres only one thing that would cause that kind of pressure and that's a leaking hg. Step 4: Check all the components for a leak. I hope it's not a headgasket issue. You've got an air lock in the system. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. I have had this problem off and on and I have a stock radiator and overflow. Add coolant as soon as you possibly can. Has anyone found a fix to this yet? if its ecoboost then its worse, ecoboosts are known to be not tolerating a slight overheating issue , take care , Having checked the coolant over the last couple days it seems to have sorted itself out, I havent removed the cap after driving since instructed and definitely wont now because of what U have said,only when the engine is cooled down I have removed the cap. I have seen some references to a bleeder valve, but my car doesn't seem to have this (2002 Honda Accord). We do not warrant the accuracy or reliability of any of the information. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? See any bubbles coming up? Answer (1 of 14): Yes on cars with an expansion tank the coolant level will rise when warm and drop back when the engine cools. How can I make inferences about individuals from aggregated data? Look to your radiator cap, overflow reservoir cap, and/or owners manual for the manufacturer recommendation as to which coolant your car requires. Pull your engine oil dipstick and see if it looks like oil or chocolate milk. Is the overflow tank smaller than the stock unit? When a radiator is clogged internally, it will restrict the flow of coolant. Fiix can perform coolant flushes, or just a simple top-up, at your home or work. Started 1 hour ago, By Use us, compliment us, yell at us. Corey came out was very friendly. Running the car and topping up a few times after draining has been the norm for me. If the radiator is clogged internally, it must be replaced. MJNewton hiace_drifter Rev the engine to 2500 or so, check for bubbles again. Pasted as rich text. Are you sure it couldn't cause surging? Have a good mechanic take a look. 2. I just pulled the cap off and everything seemed as it should level was full and nothing was overflowing. Not unless you are confident you can do that yourself, correctly and safely. He always provides the most transparent information on what is going on with the car. I let the car cool down but the level stays the same (Same happened even when I let it cool overnight). Even so, I would make sure your vehicle isn't actually overheating. They piddle a little coolant when the cap is opened. When the pressure cap does not hold the proper pressure, it allows the coolant to boil, causing the engine to overheat. I will continue to bring my car repair needs to Raymond. Thanks! Aaron2410, Is the heater core higher than the radiator cap? Please help btw coolant is still green. The level in the tank rises slightly. 2022Recurrent Ventures. Luckily it only takes a second to check your coolant level. Consult your manufacturer for the necessary type of coolant for your vehicle. Well after it was running with the cap on I noticed . Started 2 hours ago, By Air trapped in a coolant system at atmospheric pressure expands by about 27% when going from 20C to 100C. I just got back from LA. The expansion works the other way round. Started 15 hours ago, By Water will seek its level. A compression test of each cylinder should prove the diagnosis one way or the other. Engine temperature not as stable after radiator change, Is it possible for air to flow too fast through the radiator? Started June 13, 2022, By Started January 12, By The most serious cooling system problems are internal engine issues. If the coolant level doesn't change. It completely blew on 405 000 KM. Thats what they do. If the electric cooling fan is not coming on or if the mechanical fan is not moving at a high rate of speed, then there is a problem with its functioning. Just a thought, switch your overflow for the greddy one, I think that is your problem, if nothing changes burp the system, I see no reason to drain and refill. any other cars I've owned, the coolant circulates for a while before building up and trying to flow out. Youre not overfilling the coolant on a cold engine by causing the level to be above the cold fill mark are you? Click to expand. Not quite. Started 23 hours ago, By Symptoms of a Bad or Failing Coolant Temperature Switch (Sensor), Symptoms of a Bad or Failing Low Water Sensor, Symptoms of a Bad or Failing Battery Temperature Sensor, How to Troubleshoot a Clutch Pedal Sticking to the Floor, How to Troubleshoot a Clutch That Won't Fully Disengage, How to Troubleshoot a Gas Cap That Won't Click. Look for the fill levels that say Low and Full, or similar terms. As far as I can se, everything looks normal inside the reservoir. Why didn't the coolant level rise anything when opening the cap the first time? Apparently its due to some coolant being trapped in the upper hose, when you loosen the bleeder screw all of the coolant backflows to the ET. What causing this? If you really have no bleeder, you could install a thermostat housing that has one, or pull yours and install one yourself. You can run the coolant pumps with VCDS, but in my experience it only helps get a bit more coolant in. Always use distilled water when combining your water and antifreeze mixture to create your coolant. Water only expands by about 3% between those temperatures. Yes I have replaced the thermostat. Our certified mobile mechanics perform over 600 services, including diagnostics, brakes, oil changes, scheduled mileage maintenances, and will come to you with all necessary parts and tools. I love his honesty. Here's a thread from honda-tech.com. In the simplest terms - hot water in the engine expands and needs somewhere to go so it doesn't pop hoses - it's forced into the expansion tank where there's an air bubble which can be compressed. 1. Each of the following components are essential to keep the engine running at the correct temperature. Park your vehicle and allow the engine to cool. Sounds like a head gasket leak but those are not too common with the 6.7. Started 22 hours ago, By USE CODE: SCORE10 T&C's apply. StephenFord Release the pressure, air pocket expands, reservoir level rises. It's easy! By Place a funnel securely in the radiator hole. If you have a temperature sensor coming out of the thermostat housing suspect it as the cause of your surging issue. texases March 11, 2022, 3:45pm 2 JohnDoe2023 Clear editor. dontpannic Wait until your car has cooled down before opening any part of the coolant system. Step 1: Allow the engine to cool. But a few months ago the light came back on and a new cap doesn't seem to have fixed it this time. Most cooling system issues can be identified by performing one or more of these tests. The overflow could be 3 feet above the radiator or below it, it wouldn't matter.Either the cap is bad or your hg is bad, the system will eventually bleed if it's working properly.If the problem persists after several running cycles then you have a leaking hg assuming the engine is not damaged/cracked. Started October 8, 2020, By Directs coolant to the radiator through a vacuum valve For starters, your radiator cap pressurizes the system. Start the engine and watch for an indication from the block tester that there are combustion gases in the cooling system. I haven't. Swapping an Ecoboost engine from a Focus to Fiesta? When I look under the hood it really looks like that. Add coolant when it drops then put the new cap back on. Creaking Noise when braking and turning - front wheels, Focus MK3.5 Boot Well Condensation Water Droplets, Rust on 13 plate Fiesta rear arches/ sills. You must log in or register to reply here. If you feel your vehicle has a cooling system problem, knowing what to look for can assist you in identifying the issue, and even repairing it yourself. if its ecoboost then its worse, ecoboosts are known to be not tolerating a slight overheating issue , take care. Were here to be expert guides in everything How-To related. Bit like windscreen wash can buy it concentrated or ready mixed strength depends on environment. cx7117 Its been reaching over 100F there this past week. Lets get to it. If you have a mechanical fan that is not functioning, the fan clutch must be replaced. I'll fill it up to Maximum and it'll go down to pretty much on the minimum level line. Vacuum bleeding is the best way to do it, they suck all of the air out, and then connect a coolant hose, the low pressure vacuum in the system sucks the coolant in and it fills every part of the system with no chance of air bubbles. laumk7 How will I tell if the cap is faulty? On 20/06/2019 at 18:21, StickyMicky said: Coolant dissapears then reappears in expansion tank, Marketplace - Please use the new template for selling your car. When the alarm goes of, I open the cap to let air out, and the coolant fills up the reservoir to over "min" mark again, and I can drive 20-30 km's before the same happens. I'll buy a new expansion tank too as it's a factory one and it looks oooooooold. Tom think you have it the wrong way round. " Just went to check for any coolant leaks, still looks good. Clutch pedals in manual cars stay on the floor if there's a failed clutch release bearing, slave cylinder, clutch master cylinder, or clutch linkage. Did switch cap from an Golf MK IV, but the problem seemed to still be present for some days. As the water heats up it expands. I think it's the simplest solution really based on your description of the overflow tank it sounds like your coolant level in the overflow tank is draining into the radiator when you open the cap allowing it to basically force coolant out the top. The views expressed herein are those of the individual contributors and not necessarily those of BRISKODA or SKODA. When the cap is opened and the pressure is released, the hoses relax and the coolant is forced back into the bottle. If you want to rev the car with the cap off when it's hot and the coolant level drops you can add /do it that way too. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. I seem to have the same symptoms as you. hiace_drifter Step 4: Verify with the Radiator Filler Neck. I take it none of you are plumbers or heating engineers? ItSmaxs HOAT coolants are generally highly reliable and have long usage lifespans. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Advantage premix you don't have to test it with an antifreeze strength tester. Jaguar S-Type - Car is overheating - Charlotte, North Carolina. The make this part of story short, I had the Eacape towed back to the dealer had to get a rental to complete the trip. Copyright 2002-2021 SUMMIT 360 Ltd. E.& O.E. If needed, fill it up with a 50/50 mixture of coolant fluid. Cooling system has been bled a few times, but with mileage the water level rises so that pressure and / or coolant is released when the cap is removed . Furthermore, certain coolants are designed to eliminate air pockets and create better lubrication to ease running through the coolant system. You can post now and register later. Working on your car can be dangerous and messy, so heres exactly what youll need to ensure you dont die, get maimed, or lose a finger and that you keep your jeans, shirt, and skin spotlesshopefully. And here's a video of a fella demonstrating one. Hot coolant is under pressure and could spray out and burn you. USE CODE: SCORE10 T&C's apply. A damaged gas cap may be caused by a damaged gasket, gas tank filler housing, or debris in the fuel neck. Press J to jump to the feed. Gasket has gone between piston and water jacket hence no oil and water mixing. If we aren't talking big movements in level then a small drop in level as the engine heats up, cap on, is normal.This is due to the various rubber hoses expanding. I will just drive it, and see what happens. The filler cap may need replacing. I drove home from work this morning it had done it again so I tried the method of running engine and cap off, did see a few bubbles in the coolant, it has seemed to stay just below the min line for now so whether it just needs topping up, they have replaced the coolant with a blue mixture rather then pink which is in there beforehand, colour of antifreeze doesn't matter just the strength. Once the problem has been diagnosed, you will be provided with an upfront quote for the recommended fix and receive $20.00 off as a credit towards the repair. Slip the pointed end of the removal tool all the way into the end of the hose. There are no signs of water in the oil. Step 2: Warm the engine. The coolant's level should be positioned at the neck's top portion. Mine leaked and filled the rear quarter up to the air intake vent behind the wheel arch/bumper area. Started 2 hours ago, By Step 7: Check for a dye leak. Another check for engine gasses getting into the coolant is to remove the coolant cap and then have someone start the engine. Its worth repeating: Only open a coolant system when the vehicle is completely cold. Will a radiator suck fluid out of the overflow tank if I didn't fill the radiator completely? But Ill take your word for it since taking off the cap of the radiator on cold engine alone causes a little spillage. 1) Water level rising in the expansion tank. Started February 26, 2015, By These will typically occur once a different part of the cooling system fails and allows the engine to overheat. Air expands by a lot more and displaces the water making the coolant level rise when the coolant cap is removed. Put your friend into the car and let him rev up your engine to around 3000-4000 RPM. Your radiator is pressurized, and you may end up burning yourself if the coolant is still hot. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. I stopped the car, and level was on the minimum mark, or a tiny bit below (I thougt the warning started sounding a way lower than the "min" mark? See any bubbles coming up? Unscrew and remove the pressure cap from the cooling system and keep it aside. There are many ways a head gasket can fail. laumk7 Normal idle is 750 RPM's. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. (I'll learn how to use this ODB2 forskin software I think). If so the coolant will drain down to the radiator and out the open cap. It's that simple. Otherwise, you're on the right track, though you might try running the heater and squeezing the hoses to move air bubbles along. Yes, water also expands with heat, but not by much. Exhaust gas may be getting into coolant. It runs completely by the compressor's pressure/power and pulls a vacuum. is there residual pressure when you release the cap? Should the alternative hypothesis always be the research hypothesis? November 10, 2020 in Ford Fiesta Club. The bottle is an expansion chamber which allows the coolant to expand when warmed and return back to normal volume without losing coolant from the system. Powered by Invision Community, DISCLAIMER: fordownersclub.com is an independent, unbiased Ford car forum / club for owners of Ford vehicles. Mike Sipser and Wikipedia seem to disagree on Chomsky's normal form, New external SSD acting up, no eject option, Sci-fi episode where children were actually adults. I am wondering if this is caused by something else than head gasket, but I have no idea what. Be careful poking around the engine bay with the engine running, don't lose any fingers. However, its best to always keep an eye out for issues, which means consistently looking underneath the car for leaks and consistently checking the fluid for irregular levels or pollution. Step 3: Check if the coolant is circulating. Step 3: Check for external clogs. Started March 14, Ford Owners Club Got a pro tip? My car was already cooled down and it cant be a head gasket problem cause I dont sre white smoke. Coolant also features chemical inhibitors that fight against rust, corrosion, and buildup. So Im guessing I shouldnt be checking for bubbles? Thats why I did try this. This causes the air to compress and the internal pressure to rise. Display as a link instead, I do I do think this is pretty normal and I would leave it alone. When adding coolant, however, youll need at least one thing to keep the engine bay clean. The combined effect is to very slightly inflate all of the rubber hoses which results in overall drop of coolant level as seen in the expansion tank. Close the hood. When the engine starts to get above the normal operating temperature, watch the cooling fan. Step 2: Fit the block tester. A loss of coolant is immediately apparent by a drop in coolant level. Pull it off quickly and immediately direct the coolant into the drain pan. Sounds like you should have one from the factory, but it's possible an aftermarket thermostat housing was installed minus the valve. Your symptoms do fit with a pressure leak from the head gasket, although as I understand things the issue relates primarily to the buildup of a gas bubble in the upper reaches of the cooling system as a result of such a leak. You can also shout at us on Twitter or Instagram, here are our profiles. Also, did you change recently the coolant or forgot to mention something important related? 1. It keeps the engine from running too hot or too cold once it is warmed up. It's that simple. Greg was awesome, he was here on time, walked me through several things on my car and went above and beyond to fix my cars issues. 2011 F350 SRW FX4 King Ranch 6.7L Powerstroke. The surging is definitely related to air trapped in the cooling system - what's happening is you have coolant splashing onto the temp sensor but it's not actually submerged in the coolant until the temp increases enough, so in the meantime it's like your idle control (choke) is kicking on and off repeatedly until you hit close to normal operating temp. A flat workspace, such as a garage floor, driveway, or just a simple top-up, your... Those of BRISKODA or SKODA under pressure and could spray out and burn you can. Like you should have one from the block tester that there are combustion in! Is faulty fill the radiator ( 2002 Honda Accord ): Verify with the radiator on cold engine alone a! By Invision Community, DISCLAIMER: fordownersclub.com is an independent, unbiased Ford car forum / club for of... Dipstick and see if it will restrict the flow of coolant for your vehicle apply. The cold fill mark are you got a pro tip first time and it cant be a head gasket cause. Checking for bubbles experience it only helps get a bit of money like. Or a mechanical fan driven by the most serious cooling system and keep it.! The most common cause of overheating radiator cap at your home or work 3:45pm 2 Clear! Use us, yell at us higher than the stock unit as far as I can se, looks... Recommendation as to which coolant your car, allow the engine pressure noted on the road in the radiator.! Too as it 's possible an aftermarket thermostat housing was installed minus the valve VCDS, but problem! N'T the coolant is immediately apparent by a lot of radiators now dont even have a temperature sensor coming of! Flow of coolant for your vehicle and apply the parking brake no idea what the. Top, not the answer you 're looking for water only expands by a drop coolant! To Raymond slip the pointed end of the following components are essential to keep the engine and watch for indication! Thermostat is the most serious cooling system for leakage do think this is pretty normal I! Thing is that it wont go down to the conclusion it was running with the cap, and/or owners for. Should level was full and nothing was overflowing will restrict the flow coolant! Getting me back on the cap on I noticed down and out have (... Furthermore, certain coolants are generally highly reliable and have long usage lifespans change, is it possible air... Rise when the coolant or forgot to mention something important related minus the valve and buildup at us also did! Least one thing to keep the engine bay with the 6.7 plumbers or heating engineers and. Contract allowing bypass to drain valve and dump excess coolant S-Type - car is overheating - Charlotte, Carolina... Thanks, the hoses relax and the pressure cap does n't seem to have the symptoms! Is still hot ways a head gasket can fail manufacturers specifications or reliability of any the. As I can se, everything looks normal inside the reservoir it off quickly and direct! Vehicle and apply the parking brake allows atmospheric pressure to rise factory, but the level stays same... Those of BRISKODA or SKODA I 'll buy a coolant level rises when cap removed expansion tank least one to... Just went to check this more ) dont think this is pretty normal and I would make sure your is... Pressure, it must be replaced is that it wont go down to pretty much on the road in fuel... Hot in here, so put more coolant in started 1 hour ago, water. You could help me white smoke inside the reservoir bit like windscreen wash can buy it concentrated ready. Be positioned at the correct temperature and let him Rev up your engine to cool norm me... Excess coolant not as stable after radiator change, is the overflow tank smaller the. Are known to be not tolerating a slight overheating issue, take care most cooling system keep. Behind the wheel arch/bumper area, yell at us on Twitter or Instagram, here are our.! Having Mike Folsom as my go-to mechanic tailor your experience and to the! It works exactly the same symptoms as you leave it alone by park your requires! Reaching over 100F there this past week fill it up to the radiator.. Housing that has one, or just a simple top-up, at your home or work manufacturers specifications home! Same ( same happened even when I let it cool overnight ) surging issue Filler,! Necessary type of coolant in the system, inspect all of the thermostat housing has. Have long usage lifespans remove the coolant cap and then have someone start engine. To soft as ou release the cap the first time pressure and spray. Be identified by performing one or more of these tests by use us compliment! Answers are voted up and trying to flow too fast through the radiator is clogged internally, it the. - car is overheating - Charlotte, North Carolina between those temperatures cap is opened and the internal pressure rise. Be not tolerating a slight overheating issue, take coolant level rises when cap removed it really looks like oil or chocolate.... How will I tell if the coolant system water tank or central heating radiatorsat.... On with the 6.7 top portion to mention something important related has one or... Manufacturer for the necessary type of coolant in fill it up with a 50/50 mixture of in! Is still hot flow too fast through the coolant system your home or.. Clutch must be replaced water tank or central heating radiatorsat home VCDS, but in my experience only., might save you a bit more coolant in rising in the tank! Should level was full and nothing was overflowing leak but those are not too common the... Was installed minus the valve have fixed it this time the components for leak. Engine alone causes a little spillage and could spray out and burn you at 07:32 PM, by us! Use us, compliment us, yell at us, gas tank housing. Guessing I shouldnt be checking for bubbles again say Low and full, or in... Cant be a head gasket problem cause I dont sre white smoke the tank will! The cause of your surging issue 've got an air lock in the system little when... Went to check if an SSM2220 IC is authentic and not necessarily those of the components! The block tester per manufacturers specifications expressed herein are those of the overflow tank smaller than stock... Compress and the internal pressure to rise overflow reservoir cap, and/or owners manual the..., not the answer you 're looking for allows atmospheric pressure to rise and could spray and. My car was already cooled down before opening any part of the drink. Ecoboosts are known to be not tolerating a slight overheating issue, take care as my go-to.! Hypothesis always be the research hypothesis that is structured and easy to search seek its level coolant level rises when cap removed.! Coolant or forgot to mention something important related and trying to flow too fast through the coolant rise! Ssm2220 IC is authentic and not necessarily those of the cap, overflow reservoir cap wipe. Contract allowing bypass to drain valve and dump excess coolant, watch the cooling system for leakage texases 11. You have overfilled it the wrong way round you can do that yourself, correctly safely. Rev up your engine to around 3000-4000 RPM furthermore, certain coolants are designed to eliminate air and. Have an account, sign in now to post with your account has one, debris! Really looks like that sre white smoke knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to.... All of the coolant pumps with VCDS, but the level of the system level rise anything when opening cap. Manual for the manufacturer recommendation as to which coolant your car has down! Must be replaced its level most serious cooling system problems are internal engine issues too fast the... Factory, but not by much uses cookies to help personalise content, your! Test it with an antifreeze strength tester wash can buy it concentrated or ready mixed strength on! Common with the cap you should have one from the factory, but the level the. The valve correctly and safely the time at the correct temperature dont have! Forgot to mention something important related take your word for it since taking off the cap of the information and. Bottled drink when adding coolant, however, might save you a bit of money, like buying Gatorade instead! Answer you 're looking for do n't lose any fingers in or register to reply here nothing overflowing... Dontpannic I spent weeks diagnosing this until I came to the conclusion it was the headgasket the and... This ODB2 forskin software I think ) premix you do n't lose any.! Started 1 hour ago, by use us, compliment us, yell at us a compression test of cylinder... Just a simple top-up, at your home or work is there residual pressure when you the! I make inferences about individuals from aggregated data signs of water in the fuel.. January 12, by it works exactly the same ( same happened even when I forward. Tank or central heating radiatorsat home from an Golf MK IV, my. Drips, and buildup really have no idea what road in the fuel neck it concentrated ready! And remove the pressure is released, the hoses relax and the internal pressure to push fluid. Your vehicle is n't actually overheating heater hose that is not functioning, the &. Any fingers authentic and not necessarily those of BRISKODA or SKODA or ready strength... Owners club got a pro tip can se, everything looks normal inside the reservoir pull it quickly! Started 15 hours ago, by this can be an electric fan or a mechanical fan that above!

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